1st of Many Interviews Across the U.S. Between Saturday and Wednesday

Salem Radio | Chicago’s AM 560 | Black and Right Show
Guest Host: Brent Hamachek | Guest: John Pudner, President, Freedom and Family Action

Radio interviews started Saturday with a Salem Radio interview hosted by Human Events Founder Brent Hamachek, filling in for John Anthony of the Black and Right show on Chicago’s AM 560, with Wisconsin Faith and Freedom President John Pudner. The interviews will wrap up on Fox News Radio stations throughout the country on Wednesday morning from 6 to 10 a.m. Central. The following is a lightly edited transcript of that interview. A few of the Fox News interviews will be posted in the days ahead.

Announcer:
This is Black and Right with John Anthony.

Opening Segment

Brent Hamachek:
Welcome back everybody. We’re halfway through this thing—we’re gonna make it. I’m Brent Hamachek, filling in for John Anthony. It’s such a pleasure to be on this side of the microphone and have a chance to talk to this audience. I’ve been a guest on AM 560 going back over a decade—different shows, different hosts—but I never dreamed I’d get to sit here, talk to guests, and talk to all of you.

I hope you’re enjoying the conversations we’ve had so far. We’ve covered a wide range of topics, and now we’re going to shift gears. I have on the line someone who is a very dear friend of mine. I like to call him the nicest person in politics. And you know—it’s easy to be nice if you’re not any good, but it’s hard to be nice when you are. John Pudner is someone who has managed to blend competence and politeness perfectly.

John, are you there?

John Pudner:
I am. Thank you—thanks for having me on.

Brent Hamachek:
John sent me a note last night and said, “Brent, you always say I’m so nice, but if you get my title wrong, we’re not friends anymore.” So let me read what he wrote.

John Pudner is the President of Freedom and Family Action, a new national group taking the model of Wisconsin Faith and Freedom nationwide. John, are we still friends?

John Pudner:
We are. Thanks for delivering that.

Brent Hamachek:
Alright, here we go. Folks, John’s an interesting guy—he’s like SpongeBob, always on screen somewhere. But the real work he does is behind the scenes. He’s been involved in grassroots election efforts, voter turnout, and successful campaign strategies for a very long time, including a significant role in flipping Wisconsin in the 2024 cycle.

So John, since I got your title right, tell us about this new initiative. What’s next for John Pudner?

John Pudner:
We’re really taking the model we felt we perfected in Wisconsin last year and applying it nationally. As you know, I’d previously run faith-based turnout efforts for the whole country in the 2000 presidential, but I focused just on Wisconsin for 2024. The idea was, as Wisconsin went, so would the country.

We focused on one state for that crucial year, but afterward, we started getting calls from people in other states. Word got out that we had distributed 402,000 voter comparison guides through churches and at doors—and that effort got results. So people started saying, “Can you replicate that model here?” And I said, yes—but let’s set up a separate group. I didn’t want to go to another state like Illinois where you are saying I’m here with a Wisconsin group.

Brent Hamachek:
Yeah, they’re funny about that—so continue.

John Pudner:
Right. So now we’re launching Freedom and Family Action. Our model is really three things:

1. Church outreach – especially in rural areas where door-knocking isn’t always feasible.
2. Door-knocking – where possible, we still believe in the power of one-on-one contact.
3. Handwritten postcards – in places where voters are too spread out to canvass, we send personalized postcards.

It’s basic blocking and tackling—get materials to people at church, at their doors, or a handwritten note in their mailbox.

Segment Two: Interpreting the 2024 Election

Brent Hamachek:
A wonderful model. What you did in Wisconsin was demonstrably effective. But you’re more than a technician, you’re a deep thinker. I want to go back and then forward.

Looking at the big picture, if we compare Trump’s 2024 win to the past 12 elections going back to 1980, here’s what we know: Trump won 49.8% of the popular vote—that’s the 9th best showing out of the last 12 winners. One of the three worse was his own in 2016. Electorally, his victory ranked 8th out of 12.

People talk about this being a golden age for America, but I want to ask—what can we really take from the 2024 election results? What does it mean, and what might be a bridge too far? We’ll get into it more after the break, but when we come back, I’ll say: John, take it.

John Pudner:
We’ll run with it.

Segment Three: Voter Shifts and Trends

Brent Hamachek:
We’re back. I’ve got John Pudner with me. John, I asked you to tell us what we can really draw from 2024 in terms of lessons learned and what’s still uncertain.

John Pudner:
It was a victory of common sense over guilt-based voting. It was a rejection of the so-called “experts” telling people to believe things like “there are 100 genders.” Voters said, “No, I don’t think I believe that.” They were done listening to that kind of messaging.

The left’s theme was “protecting democracy,” but they were simultaneously trying to imprison the nominee and bankrupt him through the courts. That backfired. Common sense issues came to the forefront—like men in women’s sports, fentanyl coming across the border, and unchecked illegal immigration.

Brent Hamachek:
Did you see any shifts in specific blocks or demographics—anything sustainable, or was it a one-time thing?

John Pudner:
Let me give you the bad news first. In Wisconsin, we had about 200,000 new, mainly rural voters come out—good, working-class people—but there’s a concern: were they Trump-only voters?

And did we lose 150,000 suburban voters who said, “This isn’t my party anymore”? That’s the pessimistic scenario—gaining short-term votes at the cost of long-term ones.

But I don’t think that’s what’s happening overall. I think there are lasting shifts—especially among parents. The issues with sports and schools really struck a chord. Even the 90 percent of parents who send their kids to public schools are worried. That’s a long-term concern, and I think they’re sticking.

Segment Four: What’s Next

Brent Hamachek:
Looking at Michigan, for example, overall turnout was high—but in Detroit and southeast Michigan, it was lower. That could’ve flipped the result if it were higher.

Looking forward to the midterms, what are you focused on?

John Pudner:
One reason we’re focused on faith-based outreach is because that used to be seen as fringe within the Republican Party. Now, it’s central. These voters—churchgoers, even if they weren’t fans of Trump’s personality—are aligned on the issues. That’s got to last.

The core group I’m focused on are regular churchgoers. Decades ago they were viewed as the fringe “religious right,” but they’re the swing voters now. A shoutout to my counterpart who runs the Georgia Faith & Freedom Coalition (Mack Parnell), in Georgia, 92% of Evangelicals voted for Trump—a record. We’ve never seen anything like that percentage going for the conservative candidate in any demographic. But there are other church-goers who are uncomfortable with Trump’s personality, and we need to make sure they turn out to vote their values based on issues in future elections. 

Final Segment: Faith and Politics

Brent Hamachek:
As we close, I want to ask—how do you balance your faith with political activism? There’s a zealousness sometimes that feels like it crosses a line. But you’ve found a way to do it gracefully. What’s your secret?

John Pudner:
I think you always have to aim to accomplish good. You can’t expect laws to enact every moral ideal—but you can put pillars in place to guide good decisions.

The left has gone so far the other way, we don’t need to be extreme to win. Even in faiths outside of Judeo-Christian ones, there’s movement. For example, in Dearborn, Michigan, the home of the largest Muslim place of worship in the Western Hemisphere, 70% of Muslims voted for Biden in 2020—but only 34% voted for Kamala Harris in 2024. That’s a big shift.

We had Judeo-Christian underpinnings that were necessary for democracy to flourish. Its faith-based voters who have been beaten down and told not to participate.

That’s why I think last week’s IRS decision—allowing churches to endorse candidates—is the biggest breakthrough since the Johnson Amendment. For decades, churches have been told they can’t get involved. Now, that changes everything. It opens the door to real outreach and turnout.

Closing

Brent Hamachek:
John, tell everyone how they can follow and support your work.

John Pudner:
Absolutely. I’d still go to www.wisconsinffc.com—that’s Wisconsin Faith and Freedom. We’re getting the national organization launched officially next week. But right now, that site has updates on what we’re doing nationwide. You can sign up for our weekly newsletter there (or to connect in other states on the new national site https://freedomandfamilyaction.com/, which as a signup page but just takes you to the Wisconsin site for news updates for now).

Brent Hamachek:
Sounds great. I encourage everyone to support John. I’ll say this in closing: John Pudner is proof that you can work in a very dirty business and play it clean—maintaining integrity and still getting results. He sets a very good example for all of us to follow.